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Are guns good or bad?

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Guns, are they good or bad?

  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Do you think that guns are good or bad?

Here are some (Well, 31,000+) comments on whether the guns are good or bad

Here is the actual blog post that they are talking about.


Being a gun enthusiast I say that guns are okay, but also realizing the danger that guns are prone to do. It should be prohibited from all places except the parks where you hunt or other hunting places, NRA meetings and places, and other places where the group has to get governmental permission to allow guns. That would be really good, if everyone, and I mean everyone would obey that law.

The current law about guns only prohibits concealment of a weapon. If you are wearing a gun on you, you have to have it showing so everyone would see it (At least I think that's what it is... it might be ancient already lol. Anyone here knows otherwise?).

The problem with that control is that there is someone prone to break the rule. To some, rules are meant to be broken, especially if they are in psychic raging mode. (I consider that to mean extremely angry to the point of hating everyone and doing something about it... like shooting people).

To counteract the possibility of someone bringing a weapon and shooting everyone (even if it is against the law), the pro-gun people say that everyone should be able to have a gun on them wherever they go, so that whenever that situation strikes, that the victims (or to-be victims) would be able to fight back and stop the shooting before it becomes a mass killing.

An alternative that I feel would be effective to prevent mass-murder from happening in gun-prohibited places like a school or a hospital is to increase security measures. Like metal detectors, video cameras in all public places (minus restrooms and locker rooms... that would be wrong wrong WRONG!), and better security personnel in public buildings.

An armed figure of authority always present and visible to everyone in public places is sure to make every to-be murdered think twice before taking out that gun.

I also don't think that there is any reason for people to be carrying guns in public places, like streets and places like that... there are no bears to be hunting or targets to be shot at in downtown or in a city (unless you are going to some gun club).

Even if the weapon is unconcealed, it is not needed in public places, but then again, it's back to the dilemma that there are people who do stupid things like I said before. There IS no need for weapons to be carried in public places, but there are people who take this fact to kill people in mass numbers.

Government won't be able to stop everyone from abusing guns with gun control laws. In fact, if a government imposes gun control laws, then the good abiding citizens (which outnumbers that bad abiding citizens in my opinion) will obey the law, but it takes one bad person to kill 50+ people.

If in that scenario (when the bad person kills 50+ people) there was no law limiting the use of gun, then there would have being a good person having a gun on hand who would have being able to cripple the bad person's shooting hand (or something to that effect), and the number of people dead could be (5-10)... that's 5-10x less people dead.

My opinion about guns is that it's good if it is used the right way. The right way being to hunt. That is the only real reason for a gun. Survival, it's in everybody's and every living being's instinct.

Wars and murders are not a good use of any gun, but having a war is century old but still not overrated and murders happen all the time... since Adam and Eve days (Cain killed Able).

So, what is your take on this issue? Is this even an issue? Are you for guns or anti-guns?
  • joebert
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I have this ominous feeling that discussions about guns have lead to more injuries than guns themselves have. :lol:

I don't like guns, they treat symptoms instead of problems. There's really no logical reason for guns to exist in this day and age. We've got video games for sport and modern farming that eliminates the need to hunt.

I'm fine with talking about guns online, but I tend to distance myself from anyone with a gun in person. Ever since the whole Dick Cheney shooting his buddy in the face incident guns just make me that much more nervous.
  • SpooF
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I haven't read through this yet, but I will sometime today I'm sure. Just saw this and wonder why you brought it up ;) then.

Quote:
(like it is about abortion but PLEASE don't talk about abortion here... not only is it off topic of this thread, it's off-topic to the entire site).
  • webmaster[+-]
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Guns are not good or bad, guns are only tools. People that use them are good and bad.
  • joebert
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Post 3+ Months Ago

webmaster[+-] wrote:
Guns are not good or bad, guns are only tools. People that use them are good and bad.


Given the same exact people in the same situation, the only difference being that in one scenario a person is holding a gun and in the other scenario the person is holding nothing, you're going to end up with different outcomes. Assuming the person who would be holding the gun takes action in both scenarios, the scenario with the gun is almost always going to end in serious injury, whereas the scenario with nobody holding anything is almost never going to end in serious injury.
  • spork
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Post 3+ Months Ago

joebert wrote:
Assuming the person who would be holding the gun takes action in both scenarios, the scenario with the gun is almost always going to end in serious injury, whereas the scenario with nobody holding anything is almost never going to end in serious injury.

I don't think "gun" is the differentiating component here. Any weapon would make that statement true. A knife, baseball bat, hot iron, or even a person trained in hand-to-hand combat would be dangerous. The fact that the weapon happens to be a gun doesn't make the gun inherently worse.
  • joebert
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Post 3+ Months Ago

For the sake of argument spork, how about you and I have a duel. You start with a knife and I will start with a gun. Do you feel that either one of us has any sort of advantage ?

Another thing to consider here, is that things like knives have practical uses. Guns are like our generations stone spear, there's really no practical reason to have a gun now.
  • kc0tma
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Post 3+ Months Ago

The whole pro gun\anti gun argument is dumb. I hunt so I own a couple rifles. But I don't own a hand gun or feel the need to carry one around with me where ever I go. Up here in NW Montana you see a lot of people packing heat in public and they generally look like they came from the shallow end of the gene pool. Carrying a weapon is more of a fashion statement than anything else.
  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

The only reason anyone would own guns is for hunting and sport.

I would like to go shoot targets some day, not to do anything bigger afterwords, but more for the fun and to see how good at aiming I am.

I'd also would like to go hunting for fun and food.


What got me started on this topic is reading about guns and remembering that there were some mass killing involved a gun. I guess if guns were unavailable, that person, being in the same state of mind, might have used a different tool as a weapon, like a knife or something.
  • spork
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Post 3+ Months Ago

joebert wrote:
For the sake of argument spork, how about you and I have a duel. You start with a knife and I will start with a gun. Do you feel that either one of us has any sort of advantage ?

Another thing to consider here, is that things like knives have practical uses. Guns are like our generations stone spear, there's really no practical reason to have a gun now.

Of course you have an advantage. Let's say we're both stranded in the woods (separately), and we're both attacked one of the scariest things I've ever seen. I have a knife, you have a gun. In this case, I think we'd both want the situation to end in serious injury... to the bear.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

The biggest thing to remember is what they teach in gun safety classes: Guns don't kill people, people kill people. That means the gun didn't shoot itself, someone pulled the trigger. Sometimes its accidental or because the person was being unsafe on purpose, in which case they shouldn't be allowed to have guns if they aren't going to handle them properly or safely. And as far as carrying a gun for self defense, those people are just paranoid anti government conspiracy theory whack jobs. I'd like to ask one of them sometimes if they've ever had to use their side arm to protect themselves and I bet 97 times out of 100 the answer would be no. Then I would ask him if there was a time when he needed his gun for defense but didn't have it, and if he answers yes I'll ask him how he got out of there alive without his gun. If he didn't need it then does he really need it now?
  • SpooF
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I have no problem with people owning a gun. But I think there needs to be stricter laws to get a gun.
  • kc0tma
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I agree with that.
  • webmaster[+-]
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Post 3+ Months Ago

joebert wrote:
webmaster[+-] wrote:
Guns are not good or bad, guns are only tools. People that use them are good and bad.


Given the same exact people in the same situation, the only difference being that in one scenario a person is holding a gun and in the other scenario the person is holding nothing, you're going to end up with different outcomes. Assuming the person who would be holding the gun takes action in both scenarios, the scenario with the gun is almost always going to end in serious injury, whereas the scenario with nobody holding anything is almost never going to end in serious injury.


If a person is decided to take it that far she/he may do it later with some other tool...
With that kind of logic you could also blame a rock or empty glass bottle for being there... just no offense. :)
  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

webmaster[+-] wrote:
If a person is decided to take it that far she/he may do it later with some other tool...
With that kind of logic you could also blame a rock or empty glass bottle for being there... just no offense. :)

With a gun you can shoot someone when you are a fair distance away, with a bottle, you have to be close to do that. Most people are able to dodge a bottle since it's not going like 700 m/s. A bullet, no one can dodge (As far as I know :shock: ).

I'm beginning to think that guns are bad... I voted that they're good.
  • spork
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Image
  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

:lol: I was thinking about that when I was posting that. I guess I'm wrong again :D
  • ATNO/TW
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Post 3+ Months Ago

"There is no spoon."
  • kc0tma
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Post 3+ Months Ago

There might not be a spoon, but there is a spork.
  • spork
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Image
  • jflynn
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I think the poll should be.. "Are Gun Laws good or bad?"

Gun Laws only affect Good People. Bad People don't care what the Laws are.
  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

jflynn wrote:
I think the poll should be.. "Are Gun Laws good or bad?"

Gun Laws only affect Good People. Bad People don't care what the Laws are.

That is what I believe as well. I guess if you read my post you would probably see that in my post.

I primarily was thinking about guns and not the laws to be the topic of this postmbut I see that the laws governing the use and accessibility to the guns would have probably being a better idea... I can't edit my original post now, but that pertains to guns so that is part of this topic.

I personally don't think gun laws do much (except for the ones that governs the accessibility of it) since (like you said) that it's only for good people since those are the ones who actuallly follow them. Bad people ignore them, but making guns batsmen reach would make gujs hard to feach for 'some' people. Other people might have connections or find a way around the law.
  • kc0tma
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Post 3+ Months Ago

jflynn wrote:
I think the poll should be.. "Are Gun Laws good or bad?"

Gun Laws only affect Good People. Bad People don't care what the Laws are.


I've seen bumper stickers that say "If you outlaw guns, only the outlaws will have guns." I think pretty soon it might be "If you outlaw masturbating, then only the outlaws will masturbate." How does Christine O'Donnell really plan on enforcing that law if she gets elected and actually manages to have that made into a law?
  • Jowebart
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I don't have the privilege in my country to go to a gas station and buy a gun ( i mean a real one). Here only authorities are allowed to wear , shot and own a gun ... i am not saying is a good or bad thing , but i would really like to know how is to go hunting for real :) not blank , not C0²..
  • Joey Link
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I own the largest firearm website in the Northwest. I think you guys can figure out how I voted ;)
  • Rabid Dog
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Post 3+ Months Ago

By virtue of the fact that guns are inanimate objects there is no possible way they can be good or bad. Being good or bad ties directly back to being able to actively decide on the action you going to take.

I often marvel at how people will ban guns but knives are never to be banned, large woodden beams, baseball bats, bricks, rocks, cars, trucks or anything that has the capacity to kill is left alone. Is it because they have a purpose other than destroying a target? Knives are far more dangerous than guns with in 7 meters of a target if the fire is holstered. Most law enforcement officers get killed with in 0-6 meters by knives. Knives never run out of ammunition and cut through bone and tissue. Knives are easier to conceal and get rid of but ban the guns though ;)

I am willing to state that should a "bad" guy have a gun you are gonna wish that a good guy also has one.

As for dodging bullets, well Bogey, you can actually. Let us talk hypothetically for a second. A knife with a 12cm blade has a lethal area of? You guessed it 12cm, 2cm of which is all that is require to hack open your juggular, femoral or any other major blood vessels. A general swing of any knife (check out your favourite steak knife or bread knife) could in likely hood take off fingers or leave a rather unsitely gash in ones flesh.

Now on the other hand lets take a commonly used handgun caliber. 9mm. This is the diameter of the bullet head. 9mm to hit the target. Add the recoil from discharging the weapon and you start getting a great deal of time to move out of the way. 9mm is also the caliber used in the MP5 automatic sub machine gun.

So if you ask me to take my chances against 9mm bullet or a 12cm blade, I am gonna go for the bullet thank you very much and don't argue about range because if you are standing 50m out and someone takes a shot at you, you need to ask why you were there. Most self defense shootings happen with in 7m, the effective range of the knife.

Anyways, having done CQC and recently having started Systema I think the whole world needs to catch a wake up and stop blaming weapons for death. There is only one thing that makes a weapon dangerous and that is a man. Confiscating them will not work, you make your civilians targets for violent crimes.

That being said, I think the real question is this. Are human beings good or bad?

P.S. Please note that I have not included assault rifles or high power rifles. Those fall into a whole new game.
  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

A knife you can dodge no matter what... the knives aren't moving at 500 feet per second. It gives you a moment to dodge and disarm the opponent. A bullet though travels at 500 f/s if not more, and you are telling me you can dodge that?

You can't... you are relying on the opponent missing the target, or hitting a non-major spot on your body... that would be lucky, not skill.

There are ways you can disarm your opponent in a knife fight with or without a knife... there is no way to dodge a bullet except for the opponent missing you or you wearing the riot shield (or something to that effect).

But I agree with you that it's not the gun but the human being that makes the result good or bad out of the gun. The gun is just an inanimate object with no thoughts to be bad or good. I guess I didn't initiate the correct topic to yield a more fruitful discussion, but I think that it is turning there so it's all good.

I wonder what psychological mindset or what makes the person react in the way he/she does with a gun.
  • spork
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Bogey wrote:
A knife you can dodge no matter what... the knives aren't moving at 500 feet per second. It gives you a moment to dodge and disarm the opponent. A bullet though travels at 500 f/s if not more, and you are telling me you can dodge that?

There are ways you can disarm your opponent in a knife fight with or without a knife... there is no way to dodge a bullet except for the opponent missing you or you wearing the riot shield (or something to that effect).

I know this is going to sound silly but the idea made me completely chance how I viewed the threat of a knife.

Put on some crappy jeans and a tshirt and give your friend a red Sharpie. Tell him/her to "attack" you with the marker as if it were a knife. The "fight" stops if you can successfully restrain you friend or you give up.

Afterwards, look for all the red marks on your body and clothes. Each one of those is a cut or gash; a spot from which you are bleeding out. Even a few well-placed nicks are enough to make it life-threatening.
  • Bogey
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Ok, how do you do something like that but relevant to guns?
  • spork
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Post 3+ Months Ago

You're missing the point.

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