spain

  • Vladdrac
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I understand terrorists hatred towards america, but what the hell did spain ever do?

It just proves how senseless al-qadea is
  • Cool#9
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Post 3+ Months Ago

All military forces that participated in the Afghan war and Iraq will be it!
Included my calm country Canada
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Vladdrac wrote:
It just proves how senseless al-qadea is



less brain.....
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Cool#9 wrote:
All military forces that participated in the Afghan war and Iraq will be it!
Included my calm country Canada


we have troops in afghanistan, and I , like the majority of Canadians, agree with this action. We, however, have no troops in Iraq, and I, like most Canadians, Agree with this action.

The war in Afghanistan and the war in Iraq are 2 different wars, one is to stomp out terrorism, and the other for oil- erm, Sadam
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I don't agree with our occupation there. All we here about are our soldiers dying for a third world country that probably will stay underdeveloped and close to anarchy.

I would agree with the war for oil part, except it still costs me 30 dollars to fill up my tank
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Post 3+ Months Ago

war war war war war, i hate this word easy to write it or to pronounce it.
but difficult to describe it.

killing people, and at the end of the day we are killing each others for oil, money stupid things.
  • Vladdrac
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Post 3+ Months Ago

..part of society, or so says plato
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Post 3+ Months Ago

IH8Purple wrote:
...The war in Afghanistan and the war in Iraq are 2 different wars, one is to stomp out terrorism, and the other for oil- erm, Sadam


IH8Purple, Sadam and Alkeida ad one thing in common, World trade center, so in away it is the same war!
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Everyone you have it ALL WRONG!

We are "spreading" democracy!!!!


:roll:
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Post 3+ Months Ago

b_heyer, now that’s a good sarcastic reply ;)
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Cool#9 wrote:
IH8Purple, Sadam and Alkeida ad one thing in common, World trade center, so in away it is the same war!


*blink* there was a reason other than oil for going into Iraq? I would like to hear it

but don't you worry, the US isn't starting this war over just Iraq oil, it's mainly over Saudi Arabian oil. *tiredly points to map* you will notice that the US has fairly strong connections with all the countries containing oil around Saudi Arabia. this entire "campaign"(willing to change that if someone can think of a better name) helps to put pressure on Saudi Arabia.

If you don't belive me and you would rather ba a Crap News Network drone, go right ahead


PS: It should be made know that by not being a CNN drone I don't mean just listening to my opinions, nor do I mean not watch CNN, I mean watch CNN if you have to, but also get stories and opinions from the other side (such as AlJezeera or main other
Middle eastern papers/sites)
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Post 3+ Months Ago

You know, I am no politician...I am not looking for any whys that things happen or there hidden agendas. All that I know is that it is real unfortunate that young men are losing there lives over in Iraq. They are just doing there job. I just hope that someone gets off there a** real soon and pull out of it.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

[quote="Vladdrac"]All that I know is that it is real unfortunate that young men are losing there lives over in Iraq. They are just doing there job
quote]

and I totally agree with that, I think the war in Iraq is a fool's war (mind you I guess you got the best fool in the world working on it ;))

I also wonder how long it will take the states to figure out you can't fight an -ism

communism
terrorism
capitalism
consumerism
etc.

all Ideas, and people will support one of these ideas such as they have for a long time. and some fool's war is not going to change people's way of thinking
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Post 3+ Months Ago

the people in iraq were living, harsh impoverished lives, devoid of all freedom of expression under the rule of saddam...

was it a war for oil? yes, that was one of the factors... of corse it was, nothing is every pure and simple...

did saddam have WMDs? *YES HE DID*, HE HAD BEEN IN VIOLATION OF UN SACTIONS FOR YEARS!!! remeber how the weapons inspectors said that they had found destroyed (within a few months) mustard gas stockpiles, etc??? the fact that he had them says *VIOLATION*, and yet the UN kept cutting him slack... and he just kept on commiting more and more violations, and the UN just kept on giving him a longer and longer leash... the UN was *NOT* going to do anything about it, ever, the whole WMD thing had been going on since the late 90s...

the fact that the US went in without the UN, bad move, it defeats the entire purpose of why the UN was set up... if france, and germany, and all the other countries who were officially against the war in iraq wanted to give saddam all the time he wanted, and wanted to block any attempts to stop him, then the US should have washed their hands of the entire matter, and when something did happen, they could have just shrugged and said 'we told you so, we tried several times, you wouldnt listen, hes your problem now' at let the UN deal with it in whatever effed up way they wanted...

will the iraqis still be living impoverished lives after the war? yes, but they will they be able to say what they think without fear of getting shot, and that is, in some small way, a good thing to say the least.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

sorry Cal, you just open up a whole other story... ok, last argument before I got to bed.

Define freedom and Expresion? being able to act the way you want to any time you want to?
Under my impression there is nowhere in the world that you can do that.
Also do you know any of these people?
Have you ever lived in Iraq or a similar country?
how do you know if they mind the old rules or not?
these rules didn't just pop out of fat air...
the were designed for a reason.
- TO MY KNOWLEDGE -
These laws were put in place to protect the people
- / TMK -
only these 'protections' are different from yours
so you call the people oppressed



Are you saying that we should discriminate against these countries because they are different from our own
I find that extremely similar to racism, abet, let alone intolerance
also change an entire countries way of life, that has been preserved for centuries, can have devastating consequences
mush the same as there rules being dropped in the US would shake you up good, and cause rebellion, among other things
could the same not happen to them?
(RIGHT I FORGOT, your already discriminated because they are different, why not treat them like animals to)


I do agree that there were more factors than oil.

and yes SADDAM HAD WMD, where do you think they cam from?
the US, that how they knew Saddam had them, the kept the receipts
do I need remind you that the US put Saddam in power?
now that Saddam isn't being their little puppet, they are pulling all this $#!^ out on him
*THE US PUT SADDAM INTO POWER AND GAVE HIM WMD*

now since I have the chance, lets discus this WMD thing.
why shoul;d the US be allowed to have WMD, and other countries not?
if we are going to expect them to behave like us
(since we are already treating them like animals and assimilating them)
should they not have the same rights and freedoms as us?

do you not belive you have a 'God given right to bear arms'
this of course is only for your protection, but how do you protect yourself from a country?
big weapons, aka, WMD

why should the US be allowed to have something and deprive these other countries of it?
RIGHT, this is one of those things not exclusive to WMD
there is also things like access to water.

As for the UN argument, they weren't giving Saddam all the time he needed
they were giving their own inspectors all the time they needed
after all, they had to be sure that the weapons the US gave them were still there, and hadn't already been sold somewhere else
because then they could be missing a factor for going in for oil.



As for being able to say anything they want without fear of being shot.
with all you 'gun-tooting americans' hanging around in the US,
do you think that you can say anything YOU want?
can you walk infront of the white house and preform a large PEACEFUL demonstation?
or will the goverment fear what you are going to say and tear gas you?
are there not entire agecnies set up to the 'homeland security' crap that monitors things you say and do?
also, eliminating the government (if that is possible) doesn not eliminate everyone that wants you to shut up
in there cultre it is ok to use a gun as 'coaxing' to get what you want.
for example, when I lived in the middle east (my time in Isreal I belive) there was one event I can still remeber clearly. my mother and I were waiting in line at McDonalds, then a man comes in, puts a gun to our backs, and we lets him order before us
he still paid for what he orderd, but had someone else been in our shoes, had they had a gun. 1 or 2 of those men with guns would have been killed, and atleast 1 surrounding IONNOCENT person would have been killed or injured.
THIS IS THEIR CULTURE, they have lived this way forever
you can't walk in and change everything they belive in



so for all you people to lazy to read the whole thing, I have countered her 4 points repectively with:

1) Who put Saddam into power? and were there lives truly that bad? or are you just being racist because there lives were different?

2)there are more factors then oil. I have no argument

3) Who sold Sadam the WMD? THE STATES. why can the states have WMD and not other countries? Why do you deprive them of one of the things you value so much? (the right to carry arms and defend yourself)

4) The UN was giving there own people time (the states are part of them) and not giving Saddam the time he wanted.

5) there will still be other groups that will kill you for daying something wrong, even with a new gov. you can't say what you want in your country




ok, this took me 20 mins to type up, so, there may bew a post inbetween the time I started and the time this goes up, so, that doesn't mean I can't disprove there new points, it just means I haven't had time yet.

note to self: if there is anything that get you wraped up for bed, it's writing a page long, could be essay, just to prove your point, to some person on the internet, that you will most likely never see face to face. ;)
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Quote:
Have you ever lived in Iraq or a similar country?

yes i have, i lived overseas for the first 15 years of my life, im 16 now, and i have lived in several african, middle east, and asian countries... have you?

Quote:
Define freedom and Expresion?

being able to say or do whatever you want, as doing so does not infringe on the rights of another person or group of people

Quote:
how do you know if they mind the old rules or not?

i dont, because if they had said they didnt under saddam's government the would have been shot... however, the iraqis who lived in the US before the war openly opposed Saddam...

Quote:
- TO MY KNOWLEDGE -
These laws were put in place to protect the people

how is being shot for expressing a dissenting opinion a protection?

Quote:
Are you saying that we should discriminate against these countries because they are different from our own

are you saying that we should have left things as they were, without basic human rights, as defined by the UN. even when saddam had been accused of violating the human rights of the Iraqi people by the UN?

Quote:
...their rules being dropped in the US would shake you up good, and cause rebellion, among other things could the same not happen to them?

damn right it would, because if their rules applied here, we would not be able this conversation. are you saying that just because a system of government has existed for hundreds of years that it is automatically right?

Quote:
RIGHT I FORGOT, your already discriminated because they are different, why not treat them like animals to

how am i discriminating? to the best of my knowledge most of the iraqi people are glad that Saddam is out of power, albiet they want the United States gone too, but that is another argument...

and how is the US treating the Iraqi people like animals?

Quote:
why shoul;d the US be allowed to have WMD, and other countries not?

i never said the US should...

Quote:
there is also things like access to water.

ummm... this one is new to me? how are we depriving the Iraqi people access to water now???

Quote:
As for the UN argument, they weren't giving Saddam all the time he needed they were giving their own inspectors all the time they needed

and this is why inspections had been goign on since the 90s, saddam threw the inspectors out, the UN did nothing, and when it became clear that the US was not goign to stand for this, Saddam let them back in, yet still dicked around with the inspectors by keeping them out of several of his palaces, and other buildings, and when he finally let them in, there had been more then ample time to do whatever he wanted inside...

Quote:
do you think that you can say anything YOU want?

yes i do, because as long as i do not advocate violence, the government will defend my right to say whatever the hell i want.

Quote:
can you walk infront of the white house and preform a large PEACEFUL demonstation?

yes, i havent, but other people have...
random search on google turned up this: http://dc.indymedia.org/newswire/display/35537
see? demonstration... as long as demonstrations do not turn violent, they are protected under the US constitution.

Quote:
were waiting in line at McDonalds, then a man comes in, puts a gun to our backs, and we lets him order before us
he still paid for what he orderd, but had someone else been in our shoes, had they had a gun. 1 or 2 of those men with guns would have been killed, and atleast 1 surrounding IONNOCENT person would have been killed or injured.
THIS IS THEIR CULTURE, they have lived this way forever

so its ok for innocent people to be killed because it is part of their culture? hrm... ok.... right... i dont care what the reason is... nobody has the right to kill anybody.
  • Vladdrac
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Post 3+ Months Ago

sorry for opening the can of worms on this post. What my intention was that it is really messed up and I feel really bad for spain. I like spain, it is a beutiful country.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

sorry...

spain has never done anything to deserve any of this... you are right Vladdrac, it proves that Alqueda is only out to cause terror, and nothing but...

and IH8purple... it is obvious we both think the other is totally wrong, can we both just agree to disagree?
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Calendae wrote:
IH8purple... it is obvious we both think the other is totally wrong, can we both just agree to disagree?


yeah sure, after all saying that saves me thirty minutes of resonding to your post, only to have you not agree with what I posted.

and so you know, I spent 4 years in the middle east.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I don't watch war on tv, i don't read about war, yea i prefer to pretend it is'nt happening :cry: to me our mums and dads suffered enough!
We in England got involved through bush, all i know now is we are on **red alert** the Palace for their sins (i hate royalty) are to get a huge mega out of this world structure in case of a hit, i could say something but i won't!!
Now all i want to know is this, "why in gods name would Bali get "hit" can someone tell me the answer to that !
The twin towers are still very vivid in my mind and would'nt want to be able to see peeps jumping out of windows to their death ever again..not ever in my lifetime!
All this killing and bloodshed i place firmly at bushes door! the bit of tv i did watch at the twin tower disaster became very clear it was bush that bin laden wanted not the people!
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Quote:
the bit of tv i did watch at the twin tower disaster became very clear it was bush that bin laden wanted not the people!

he wanted bush by attacking the WTC??? what??? new york, washington, NY, DC, right... im not even going here...

the bali bombing was senseless, i was in jakarta when it happened... it was a completely pointless and senseless thing... just like anything that involves killing innocent people is...
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Quote:
im not even going here...
and i don't blame you Calendae either !!
If i could have just one wish i would wish to see all the people all over the world live in peace and harmony again!
I just wanted to say a little, i don't usually enter disscussions!
suzie.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Being an active duty Marine and served with the first Marine Unit into Afghanistan after 9/11 and caused much damage and death in Afghanistan I would like to say, Afghan and Iraq are getting what they deserve. WTC was senseless, especially since we helped Osama in the past, bad move on our part but not much you can do about that now. I don't really care if we are going into Iraq for oil, my main concern is killing every terrorist bastard there is. Yes, we are just doing our job and a majority of the Marines and Soldiers I know feel the same way. You do not strike our country without feeling the wrath. Just ask the Japanese. We should nuke both countries and open a Disney World. Just 2 cents from a war mongering Marine that supports Bush's war on Terror.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Well you know what, I think what you just said was real insensitive to a lot of people. I hope someone will come and lock this thread.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

grinch2171 wrote:
Being an active duty Marine and served with the first Marine Unit into Afghanistan after 9/11 and caused much damage and death in Afghanistan I would like to say, Afghan and Iraq are getting what they deserve. WTC was senseless, especially since we helped Osama in the past, bad move on our part but not much you can do about that now. I don't really care if we are going into Iraq for oil, my main concern is killing every terrorist bastard there is. Yes, we are just doing our job and a majority of the Marines and Soldiers I know feel the same way. You do not strike our country without feeling the wrath. Just ask the Japanese. We should nuke both countries and open a Disney World. Just 2 cents from a war mongering Marine that supports Bush's war on Terror.



U should really respect your self and others here, and if you dont care you should not be here.

who do u think u r to judge this way.
this is very silly and should not be allowed here.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Vladdrac, i agree when i saw that post i had no intentions of subscribing to it again.
What i saw when those planes hit has left its mark and i don't even live there, i just thought no, its going to miss it, but no it did'nt, then after that the peeps falling..hoping they could survive.

I had to sit in my chair at home knowing ful well there was nothing i could do to help them, did grinch2171 actually see that aweful sight, he can't have or he would'nt say those things.
I will now leave this thread.
:(
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Post 3+ Months Ago

grinch2171 wrote:
Afghan and Iraq are getting what they deserve. I don't really care if we are going into Iraq for oil, my main concern is killing every terrorist bastard there is. Yes, we are just doing our job and .


Dont forget Insect people are dying.
or u dont care too,.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Quote:
who do u think u r to judge this way


What exactly did I judge here. I offered my opinion from a stand point of someone serving in the military. If I offended you, please excuse me, but that still doesn't change my stance on the war and what we are doing as a military force. The Afghan and Iraqi people are now enjoying a lot of stuff they didn't have before. Schools are reopened, new businesses are opening, technology is being implemented. Women can wear what they want without fear of being beaten in the streets.

What I said may have been harsh but the job of the Marine Corps is to go in and wipe out the bad guys and then leave the occupation part up to the Army. We are not designed to be peace keepers and don't have the mentality for it, but that is slowly changing in our training. From day 1 in boot camp we are trained to kill. Sorry if my abrasive attitude offended any of you but being shot at tends to change your mind on a few things.
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Quote:
I had to sit in my chair at home knowing ful well there was nothing i could do to help them, did grinch2171 actually see that aweful sight, he can't have or he would'nt say those things.


How can I live in America and not see it. How about getting ready to leave that very night to go help dig bodies out, how about getting on a ship 9 days later heading straight to Afghanistan, how about getting shot at by these bastards. You ever think about that. What I saw that day is the very reason I have the attitude I do. I don't feel sorry for the terrorists. I feel sorrow for my fellow brothers that died in Iraq and Afghan but it is part of serving our great country. Our freedom has grown from the blood people like me have shed throughout the years. So before you judge me, stand in my shoes and see the things I have seen first hand and try and get a good night sleep.

By the way
Quote:
Dont forget Insect people are dying
I didn't insult you so please don't insult me.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

grinch2171 wrote:
Quote:
I had to sit in my chair at home knowing ful well there was nothing i could do to help them, did grinch2171 actually see that aweful sight, he can't have or he would'nt say those things.


How can I live in America and not see it. How about getting ready to leave that very night to go help dig bodies out, how about getting on a ship 9 days later heading straight to Afghanistan, how about getting shot at by these bastards. You ever think about that. What I saw that day is the very reason I have the attitude I do. I don't feel sorry for the terrorists. I feel sorrow for my fellow brothers that died in Iraq and Afghan but it is part of serving our great country. Our freedom has grown from the blood people like me have shed throughout the years. So before you judge me, stand in my shoes and see the things I have seen first hand and try and get a good night sleep.



I am really sorry for what happened to your brothers.
but u know that working in the army serving your country is not like working in a fun place.
then you are judging bc of what happened to you, we judge in general.
and for the second reason Iraq were terrorist. prove it if its so.
people should not pay of what the politic says and do.

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