your son is GAY???

  • BlueHat
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I hope this wont be very weird,

what would u do if ur son is GAY??
  • Axe
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Buy him a feather boa?
  • Tom the Great
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Would support him anyway. It's his decision to make, not mine. I would still love him, still be a father and all that stuff, the relation ship wouldn't change.
  • musik
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Who cares as long as they are happy and healthy - being gay isnt something you choose, its something your born with :D

People who shun their children because of their sexuality set themselves and their kids up for a very bumpy ride.

I really think if someone loves their child then they will accept the choices they make for themselves and just want for them to be happy and comfortable with themselves. Same sex attracted people have a hard enough time dealing with societies negative views let alone to have to deal with that at home where it should be somewhere they can be themselves :D
  • BlueHat
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Tom the Great wrote:
Would support him anyway. It's his decision to make, not mine. I would still love him, still be a father and all that stuff, the relation ship wouldn't change.



Thats nice, hard to find this kind of answers??
  • BlueHat
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Post 3+ Months Ago

musik wrote:
Who cares as long as they are happy and healthy - being gay isnt something you choose, its something your born with



i have read on one magazine, that being a gay become more fashionable these days!!!

thats way the amount of gays have increased so much??

not sure?
  • Tom the Great
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I think it's getting more 'accepted' in the media, not really more 'fashionable.'

20 years ago, a lot of people thought only gay people would get aids, so there were probably a lot of people who were gay inside but weren't because of the fear of aids.
The media plays a big part as well, I was watching good ole' fox news and the first half of the show was just about gay marriages. So gay people are in the news and someone sitting in their cave thinks, "look at all the gay people sprouting up," but there were the same amount of gay people, they just weren't in the news.
It's a pretty confusing topic.
  • BlueHat
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Tom the Great wrote:
I think it's getting more 'accepted' in the media, not really more 'fashionable.



i would agree with you
  • musik
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Post 3+ Months Ago

ive been closely associated with the gay community and I can tell you from working with SSAY (same sex attracted youth) that its something they are born with. yeah there are those who just love sex and dont care who its with but for the majority of the population, its something that

there are more now because law and societies views are becoming more libral in their views.

churches are now accepting gay priests and also gay women priests (we have some here in melbourne).

we have just had a state here in australia give the okay for gay parents to adopt children (finally) and laws are also changing to give their partners more rights when their partner dies (under old laws they could not recieve anything).

im glad things are changing for the better! There is absolutely nothing wrong with it :D
  • BlueHat
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musik wrote:
churches are now accepting gay priests and also gay women priests (we have some here in melbourne).


that sounds new to me??I
  • musik
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Post 3+ Months Ago

yep its mainly the christian churches
  • musik
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Gay priests
http://www.inthefaith.com/archives/000313.php
http://www.anglicanmedia.com.au/news/ar ... 001752.php

Female bishops
http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2003/ ... 69716.html
  • UNFLUX
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Post 3+ Months Ago

where do you come up with these questions? I thought this
was a webmaster's board.

.....or did I miss something :scratchhead:
  • ThATKiD
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i would put a mic in his hand teach him a Ricky martin song strap on some bell bottoms and get rich off his feathery ass wooohooo .. . . ok no seriously cant be said till the situation arrives we can all give the bs politicly correct response but when it boils down to it no one knows till it happens
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Post 3+ Months Ago

i would beat the living crap out of him
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Post 3+ Months Ago

LMAO!!!
  • joebert
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If people are born gay, where did they get thier gay genes from ? :wink:
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joebert: from god lmao

unflux: well it is a general thread lol
  • joebert
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musik wrote:
joebert: from god lmao


They don't get them from Macys ?
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Post 3+ Months Ago

For the record, I agree with UNFLUX that it's a pretty odd question for a webmaster board. Secondly, I'm a Christian. Third, I added the second one to say that my religious beliefs have absolutely nothing to do with my opinion on the matter (I wanted to make that clear).

Now that the "for the record" stuff is out of the way:

Homosexuality is about the stupidest thing men or women ever dreamed up. Why? It's the perfect genocide. What better way to kill off a species than to find the perfect way to prevent the natural propagation of the species.

Whether God did it, nature did it, evolution did it, or whatever you are inclined to believe did it, the human race (and most animal species for that matter) require a male and female to propagate (in most instances).

The human race is virtually the only species that has any inclination towards homosexuality. So, how do so-called gays propose to propagate themselves? I cannot for the life of me believe that homosexuality is genetic and people are "born" with it. What I will allow, is that there may be some genetic influence on a person's inclination to choose homosexuality as a lifestyle, but the bottom line is that it clearly defies the logic of the physiology of the human race. Therefore, the most logical conclusion is that homosexuality boils down to a choice regardless of how that choice is initiated.

Face it folks, it requires a male and a female to make a baby. Anything other than heterosexuality spits in the face of nature.

So if you want to be gay, I say go for it! Eventually you'll all die out due to lack of progeny and maybe this insane idea will eventually disappear from the planet.

Oh, by the way -- to answer the actual question - I don't have a son so that's a moot point. I do have a daughter and if it ever came down to this question with her, I would tell her exactly the same thing I said above and wish her luck. I'd probably also tell her I thought she was pretty stupid.
  • Axe
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Post 3+ Months Ago

So, to sum it all up and quote your quote "there is no fate but what we make for ourselves"? :lol:
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Post 3+ Months Ago

*smiles - yep!
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Quote:
What better way to kill off a species than to find the perfect way to prevent the natural propagation of the species.


I don’t think we’re in any danger of becoming extinct, if everyone were to become homosexual, that would be fair, but this seems like hyperbole.

Quote:
The human race is virtually the only species that has any inclination towards homosexuality.


Not true. Even with the “virtually” qualifier, there’s quite a few different animal species that exhibit homosexual/bisexual behavior. I’d send you a pdf of this paper, but our library doesn't have that journal so the abstract will have to do. No one really knows why this is, except that this isn’t something that men/women have “dreamed” up.

Quote:
Eventually you'll all die out due to lack of progeny and maybe this insane idea will eventually disappear from the planet.


If that were true, then why hasn’t this happened already? I agree with you that it doesn’t confer any evolutionary advantage (you don’t tend to get your genes passed on if you’re homosexual), but yet it (homosexuality) continues to exist. It clearly takes a male and a female to make a baby, but you’re arguing that “it spits in the face of nature”? I agree that the environment deserves our respect, but I don’t quite understand why homosexuality per se represents a disrespectful attitude toward nature.
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icyroadz wrote:

Not true. Even with the “virtually” qualifier, there’s quite a few different animal species that exhibit homosexual/bisexual behavior. I’d send you a pdf of this paper, but our library doesn't have that journal so the abstract will have to do. No one really knows why this is, except that this isn’t something that men/women have “dreamed” up.


{ agree with this and that's why I added the qualifiers.}

Quote:
but you’re arguing that “it spits in the face of nature”? I agree that the environment deserves our respect, but I don’t quite understand why homosexuality per se represents a disrespectful attitude toward nature.


{Perhaps the cliche "spits in the face of nature", didn't clearly portray my intended meaning - essentially the intent of the thought is that homesexuality clearly is a deviation of the natural order of things and IMO is a choice to refuse the natural order of things - at least in terms of reproduction}

Let me add that I have no issues at all with people who choose to be openly or secretly gay. I have had friends that are openly gay and sure I will have many more. Not a problem to me at all. My statement above is simply my opinion on the subject, plain and simple, nothing more.
  • icyroadz
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Fair enough. I disagree that it's a choice, but we certainly don't have to agree on that, it is a webmaster's forum after all. :)

An interesting observation though that homosexuality is a deviation, I mean, one could argue that your average Ozzu forum peruser has an 'abnormal' amount of knowledge on web design etc. We're all deviant, in some way. :lol:
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icyroadz wrote:
We're all deviant, in some way. :lol:


*lol -- agreed with that!!! And methinks some more-so than others! *grins
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Quote:
i would beat the living crap out of him

I would hate to be your son
  • Axe
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Why, are you gay? ;)
  • ThATKiD
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First, Axe thats inapropriete
Seccond The book of romans clearly sais that homosexuality is blasphemy now all religouse homosexuals
think about it
third are you gay? just kidding i personaly dont care to what anyones sexual prefrence as long as im not gay
  • IH8Purple
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Post 3+ Months Ago

why are you people so afraid of gay people?
why do you think it is a bad thing?

lastly, if you just let gays be gays, then eventually there will be no more gays (assuming it is genetic)

besides what fun would beer commercials be without lesbians?
  • ThATKiD
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were talking about gay men lesbians must never die!!!! like i said before sexual preference isnt important to me but alot of religions dont agree with it
  • natural_angel33
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*thinking very hard how to not offend anyone*

OK... first all the following is strictly my opinion and I have nothing against homosexuality. I believe that everyone has their own beliefs and choices and they should not be attacked for them. If everyone would just love each other then everyone would be happy. :rotatingsmile:

I personally think that homosexuality is a choice, because some friends I've had in High School who were homosexual then, are now married (to the opposite sex) with families. One of which was a very close friend. When he told me he was getting married to a girl I was confused and he said *exactly* these words:

"I just don't feel like being with guys anymore. It hasn't attracted me since we met. [His now wife] I love [wife's name], and I knew that when I met her."

I don't know, after that I always believed it was a choice.

If my son told me he were gay, I would be upset at first because my personal beliefs are that he will not go to Heaven. However, I would never belittle him or treat him any differently than I do now. He's my flesh and blood and I love him with all I am. His choices cannot change that.

Which is why I think that anyone who "beat the living crap" out of ANY member of their family for ANY reason is a complete jerk and shouldn't be allowed to have children! :bad-words: :biggun: :brutal43:

(But that's another rant for another day...)
  • ThATKiD
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i agree with umm [ insert previouse post writers name here ] I am im Highschool and I have a friend who is sexually reatarded, confused, n/a, he claims to be gay ones day the next day i see him with the most beautiful women i think that it is a choice many teenagers make in high school for attention because its fashionable and tend to grow out of it. In my grand parents and parents age someone who grew up a homosexual would become one dew to a tramatic childhood or lac of attention not just for the hell of it. things change and as they said before it has become more fashionable

**i think therefore i am sorry if i offended anyone
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ThATKiD' wrote:

**i think therefore i am sorry if i offended anyone


A couple thoughts from "the old fart" around here. If you state something you feel is true you should never apologize for stating such...(or at the least don't apologize in advance). The only time you need to apologize is if you were incorrect/wrong or intentionally, or unintentionally hurt someone physically or mentally.

Offering your opinion is your right, and you should never apologize for what you believe in, unless you discover your beliefs were/are wrong.
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Well in that case i retract my statement ATNO i dont acustom to apologize for my opinions but since it is a public board with many people and such a touchy subject i didnt want anyone to get the wrong impresion
  • Nucleo
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Quote:
Why, are you gay? :wink:

no, im not gay....

but imagine if i came home with a girlfriend that he didn't like?...

would he beat the crap outta me?..
:twisted:
  • icyroadz
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Well, I don't have too much more to say on this, but... :)

In the early 90's there were a couple of studies of identical twins (ie. two people, identical genes). If one was homosexual, the other had about a 50% chance of also being homosexual. In the case of fraternal twins (share 50% of their genes) this chance dropped to about 15-20%. If you looked at adoptive siblings (not genetically related), the chance dropped to about 5-10%.

Two things you can take out of that: 1. genetics does play a role, 2. but it's not everything. One identical twin is gay only means the other has a 50% chance suggests that something else is at work: environment, hormones, personal choice, rays from outer space, I don't know :)

I think that some people (like the examples above) probably choose homosexual behavior at some point even some who would identify themselves as heterosexual, but I think it's a little too simple to say that based on that every homosexual person chooses their orientation.

One last thing, I can't think of a single place on the web (besides here) where people could have a discussion about this kind of a subject, and hear each other out, and not have a flame war break out. Kudos to Ozzu!
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heh, well I think that most of the people on ozzu have better things to do with their time then post pictures that everyone has already seen 1 million times

besides that I think that this is not a topic that should be really discussed as defining homosexuality iss very difficult

people opinions on what homosexuality is differs
-basic thoughts (everyone has had them)
-wondering if you are gay (again everyone)
-preforming semi-sexual acts on same sex (I think most people have done this, even as a joke)
-preforming sexual acts on same sex
-unity of 2 same sex people (hard to define in its own, but for the sake of this argument say marriage)

as you can se people opinions may differ on what homosexuality is, therefore making it difficult to have an intelligent conversation unless a common to argue upon
  • lostinbeta
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It is/was interesting to see some of the reactions on the subject.
  • Axe
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ThATKiD' wrote:
First, Axe thats inapropriete


No it's not. tbone said he'd beat the living crap out of his son if he were gay.

Nucleo said he'd hate to be his son.

so, I was curious as to if he was or not. He doesn't have to answer, and it doesn't bother me one way or the other :)
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i was only kidding Axe i just wanted to take the focuz off the guy incase he was gay :?:
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icyroadz wrote:

One last thing, I can't think of a single place on the web (besides here) where people could have a discussion about this kind of a subject, and hear each other out, and not have a flame war break out. Kudos to Ozzu!


A most excellent observation icyroadz, and I second your Kudos!
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Nucleo wrote:
Quote:
Why, are you gay? :wink:

no, im not gay....

but imagine if i came home with a girlfriend that he didn't like?...

would he beat the crap outta me?..
:twisted:


8)
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icyroadz wrote:
One last thing, I can't think of a single place on the web (besides here) where people could have a discussion about this kind of a subject, and hear each other out, and not have a flame war break out. Kudos to Ozzu!


That may be because the question at hand is based upon ones opinion thus no one can argue to back that up with facts. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, and chances are you aren't going to change their mind about it by arguing with them.
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lostinbeta wrote:
and chances are you aren't going to change their mind about it by arguing with them.


You're probably right, but then why talk about it at all? I think all you can do is share what you believe, and why you believe it. If, once it's over, someone (myself included) changes their mind because something someone said made sense, then it was worthwhile.

And if not, maybe we understand each other a little better, or at least we put some more wear on our keyboards, and that's always a good thing, right?
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Ah, the process of exchanging ideas, such an educational wonderment.

As you said, anothers ideas may not change/effect our own, but it definitely gives us more insight into the other person. It's a learning experience all around.
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Quote:
A most excellent observation icyroadz, and I second your Kudos!

i like kudos they make them with snikers inside them now..... and yes this is a very mature m/b i think might be due the age group of this m/b alot more adult crowd. I think i might be one of the youngest im 17.
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ThATKiD' wrote:
I think i might be one of the youngest im 17.


There are people around here as young as 13 (most likely younger, but that is the youngest I have seen)
This is one of the reasons I like ozzu, your age or social status dosn't matter,
only what you are able to take and give to the community
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i guess your right. I said that mainly because being a highshcool student I have visited the highschool m/b and . . . its beyond immature its rediculouse
  • Axe
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Yeah, but don't get us wrong... Us "oldies" can still be just as immature as the next guy - we still know how to have fun, lol. ;)
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Axe wrote:
Yeah, but don't get us wrong... Us "oldies" can still be just as immature as the next guy - we still know how to have fun, lol. ;)


well only if you consider playing Cribbage on wednesdays and Bingo on sudays fun. :P :lol:
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:rofl:
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lol...
im 16, and yes I have seen younger...
i also love a community that can share views and ideas and not get into slanging matches over the subject ;)
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All I have to say about the subject is 3 little letters......


MTV
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What about MTV?

You mean the tv station... as in Music TeleVision?

How does that have anything to do with the subject of how a person would react to their child being gay?
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I would beat up any one who Bullied him for it.

And tell Him it will be ok
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So as a parent you would beat up kids that bully your kid if your kid was gay?

Yeah, I don't think that's legal 8)
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I think its all matter of social context.

People act because they think they are rights, but they realize that they are wrong in a later time(maybe)
Being guy since the child is born. that is not Guy, thats natural (mainly the hormones are not balanced).

But i get so mad when i hear that a "man" realized after 20 years of his life that he is Guy.(like he was not able to realize from before).

""People wants to have different taste of life :wink: ""
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BlueHat wrote:
But i get so mad when i hear that a "man" realized after 20 years of his life that he is Guy.(like he was not able to realize from before).


Assuming by Guy you meant Gay, but im not sure since you replaced it with the word Guy in your whole post :wink:

It's not really a "realization" 20 years later, just finally dealing with the truth. A lot of homosexuals tend to deny who they are because the way much of society views it.

Then there's the ones who are confused and don't know what they want at an early age.
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lostinbeta wrote:
Then there's the ones who are confused and don't know what they want at an early age.


sorry for the typing mistake.


so, and what cause this kind of confusion in your opinion.
  • BlueHat
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I can go really deeply with you into this subject. which will make it more interesting.

I have been taking allot of courses in my college in this kind of field.

i am not against the idea of being Gay(assuming its from natural), but if you look around not all Gays are really born Gays. so my concern is those people who think that they are Gays because of many reasons which they dont even know what are those reasons.....
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Guess it depends on the person. My guess is that through sexual maturity a person may have feelings for both genders and not know which gender their feelings are stronger for.

As you age and mature, you tend to know what you want better than when you are younger.

Just my opinion, I can't really speak for anyone but myself.
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lostinbeta wrote:


Just my opinion, I can't really speak for anyone but myself.



hehehe.

Thats fine. :)
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BlueHat wrote:
I can go really deeply with you into this subject. which will make it more interesting.

I have been taking allot of courses in my college in this kind of field.

i am not against the idea of being Gay(assuming its from natural), but if you look around not all Gays are really born Gays. so my concern is those people who think that they are Gays because of many reasons which they dont even know what are those reasons.....


Didn't even see this post (it was posted at the same time as my post).

How do you know if all gays were born gay or not? Considering sexual feelings don't come until after you age. There is no concrete scientific evidence to prove how or why homosexuality occurs. There's plenty of theories, but when it comes down to it, only the person knows for sure how they feel.
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what about your female hormones? are they balanced or less than your male hormones :wink:
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If that's the cause, then thats something your body does naturally (unless you take hormone pills), and your body produces those hormones from birth ;)

Although i'm not entirely sure that is the cause of homosexuality. Not all homosexuals are feminine (or masculine if you're a female). Plus I was watching thing documentary on the discovery channel where this womans husband wanted to get a full sex change to be a female (not my choice to watch that btw), to do this they gave him hormone pills so his body would produce more female hormones than male hormones, didn't seem to effect his sexual preference.
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lostinbeta wrote:
to do this they gave him hormone pills so his body would produce more female hormones than male hormones, didn't seem to effect his sexual preference.



that sound kind of convince to me


mmmm,I see your point here, you have a point here :idea:
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Yep, homosexuality is way more confusing than it seems ;) Otherwise scientists would have concrete proof of how and why it occurs. Something i'd be curious to know for sure myself.
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lostinbeta wrote:
Something i'd be curious to know for sure myself.


I find any thing i will let u know :wink:
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My 2 cents on the subject...

First to answer the original question - if I had a gay son, I would do the same thing I would do if he were straight: strive to do my best as a human being, and teach him to strive to do his best as a human being. I see no reason why my behavior towards anyone should change, based on their sexual orientation.

Secondly, you must not confuse homosexual orientation with homosexual behavior. Some people are straight and may engage, at some point in their life, in homosexual behavior out of curiosity. That is not to say they'll "turn gay". They will dismiss homosexuality as inadequate for their form of being and move on.

Some people are gay, and may choose - for whatever reasons, to marry a person of the opposite sex and abandon any homosexual behavior. That doesn't necessarily make them straight either. The only factor that determines who you are is what you feel deep within you.

To say that homosexuality is a choice solely on the basis that some gay folks chose to marry into the opposite sex is as convincing as saying that a Republican turned Democrat simply because he or she married a Democrat. Personal identity isn't contagious: you can't "catch" who you truly are from someone else; this is why human beings are considered individuals.

Is homosexuality inborn or not? Is it "nature or nurture"? There are evidences that point to both possibilities. We may be born with both homosexual and heterosexual potentials; later life experiences may determine which potential becomes actualized. The debate goes on...

Does it matter? To some, it does: many religious folks, for example, want to believe that homosexuality is a choice so they can rest assured their god wouldn't punish anyone for something they have no control over. The matter, in this case, isn't about homosexuality but theology. To others it doesn't: life, whether through genetics or outside events, deals you a hand of cards, you must play it as best as can be. This includes learning to accept and love yourself, a prerequisite to accepting and loving others.

Last but not least, I'm gay. Some folks have a problem with it, some don't. To the former, I can only advise that they look within themselves with the same blunt honesty I look within myself. It is my experience that homophobia usually stems from unresolved feelings about oneself (as a note, even homosexuals can experience homophobia -- and indeed many do). To the latter, I can only offer my thanks. Not for showing a "special" kind of tolerance, or granting gays and lesbians any kind of "special treatment" -- we don't like special treatment, we've received enough of it (usually the hurtful kind) -- but for simply being human.
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People say I am gay, and then they say I was wrong. and they start looking for wife or a girlfriend. this is unpropor not only for your self but also for others.

we were born with some certain rules to follow. "GOD"
and god did not allow this.
can u tell me why most Gay people are not religion.
most people who believe in religion are not?why is that?

we as human we dont really know what we want, and if we know, it always changes. so ......

there is certain things in our life that we have to respect.
men and women are exist for a reason. opposite sex.
life continuity.
if so why we were not born all as male or female.
and to have sex you should always have opposite sex. male and female.
what about your child if your going to have? dont u think you will give different impression of what is life and why do we have different gender.
and the most important aspect for me is, how do really Gay people do sex, i find it very unpropor, you use the unpropor part of the body which is actually was made for different purpose.

when i saw your message i knew you were gay, i dont know why, may be because of your avatar
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Quote:
this is unpropor not only for your self but also for others.

People have a right to decide what is good for them. That's a basic human right.

Quote:
we were born with some certain rules to follow. "GOD"
and god did not allow this.

That is a belief, not a fact.

Quote:
can u tell me why most Gay people are not religion.
most people who believe in religion are not?why is that?

Actually, most gay people I know -- myself included, have deep religious feelings. But many of them have been rejected by religious institutions. Don't confuse God and man's institutions.

Quote:
we as human we dont really know what we want, and if we know, it always changes. so ......

So...?

Quote:
there is certain things in our life that we have to respect.
men and women are exist for a reason. opposite sex.
life continuity.
if so why we were not born all as male or female.
and to have sex you should always have opposite sex. male and female.

Is that what it's all about: making babies? Many heterosexual couples have no intentions of having children. Many can't have children, yet still become couples. Most couples do not consider their relationship to be based on procreation alone. Some of us don't think exclusively with what we have under the belly button...

Quote:
what about your child if your going to have? dont u think you will give different impression of what is life and why do we have different gender.
I will teach my child, if I decide to have one, to come to his own conclusions. That's part of what freedom means.

Quote:
and the most important aspect for me is, how do really Gay people do sex, i find it very unpropor, you use the unpropor part of the body which is actually was made for different purpose.

A vagina is made for reproduction, yet many men use it for sexual pleasure, without intent to reproduce. Many women use their partner's penis for sexual pleasure also, without intent to reproduce. How about a mouth, or a hand, or any other part of the body that is used for sexual pleasure, and without intent to reproduce? Could it be there is more to sex than mere reproduction? Could it be that people also use sex to express feelings of love and intimacy? I see a person before I see a body; what do you see?

Quote:
when i saw your message i knew you were gay, i dont know why, may be because of your avatar

Mmmmmh, maybe the fact that I said in my message that I was gay helped you a little :lol:
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Hmm...you really do have alot to say about this topic. If I found out my son was gay I would'nt care, only thing is, he better not kiss inside the house :P
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Quote:
...he better not kiss inside the house :P


Fair enough. Your house is your castle; if the host is uncomfortable with certain behaviors in his or her house, the guests must respect that.
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and why is this focused on "your son is gay"
are you trying to say that it is ok for females to be homosexual and not males ;)
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I too know many religious gay people. I myself am not one of them, but I know many exist. Can't count how many of them are even in church choir and active participants in church activities.

Some of these people have been accepted for who they are, others still hide from fear of being unaccepted. For understandable reason.

I can't tell you how many of these debates I have been in where people can't back up homosexuality as being wrong without bringing religion into the equation. As stated, religion is belief, not fact. People are free to believe what they want, but that cannot be forced upon others.

Some argue that propogation of species is what makes homosexuality wrong and that homosexuals are weaker because they cannot reproduce. I don't really buy into this one either, because it is our life and we do with it what we choose. It doesn't really effect anyone else but ourselves. But unfortunately many people out there leave homosexuals with a choice... accept who they are and be unaccepted by many people, or deny who they are and spend their life either alone or forced to pretend they are happy with someone of the opposite sex.


I have yet to answer the question, I chose not to since I felt the question was geared more towards heterosexual parents, but I will put my $0.02 in now. If I had a kid, and found out my son (or daughter) was gay, I would accept that. A persons sexual preference does not define who they are, it's much deeper than that. If you were to "disown" someone because of their sexual preference, then chances are you don't know that person at all (or they just aren't that important to you)... otherwise even if you disagreed with it you could look past it.
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IH8Purple wrote:
and why is this focused on "your son is gay"
are you trying to say that it is ok for females to be homosexual and not males ;)


Ironically that seems to be the going rate. At least with heterosexual males. Too many times have I seen the "lesbians are good, homosexual males are bad" mentality. you'd be surprised how much insight you get on how people really feel about homosexuality when they don't know the one they are talking to is homosexual
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Quote:
Some argue that propogation of species is what makes homosexuality wrong and that homosexuals are weaker because they cannot reproduce.

if they dont reproduce why are there so many of them? just messin

i had previousely also talked about gays and religion. Im gonna Blunt about it you cant be catholic or cristian and be gay at the same time. How do you figure it be consideeeeered a blasphemy by your beliefe but you practice this constantly?

I personaly dont care i have friends who are athies and jewish etc. and they dont believe in the sames thing i do so why exclude gay people i dont. i just think that religion and homosexuality dont go hand in hand.
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Well being I am not religious, nor do I know anything about religion so I will not argue that side.

I do however think that homosexuals who practice religion feel that god made them that way, and they still have the right to be accepted as gods children.

I can't speak for them though.
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everyone has there pov. i just dont agree with with certian aspects of religions and peoples veiw of it alot. But thats just me. i cant say i have alot of gay friends i honestly only have 2 and i think there cool people and thats what matters.

** pov = point of view
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Quote:
Ironically that seems to be the going rate. At least with heterosexual males. Too many times have I seen the "lesbians are good, homosexual males are bad" mentality.


Some heterosexual men find the image of two lesbians together exciting. Being the sexual conqueror that he is, man sees two lesbians as potential conquests. A "let-me-just-slip-in-between-the-two-of-you" scenario; instead of one woman, he gets two. Of course the fact that they are lesbians, therefore not sexually attracted to him, is of no importance to a heterosexual man. ;)

In the case of two men together, there is nothing for a heterosexual man to conquer, only the fear that he himself might be conquered -- which party explains why so many straight men believe and fear that all gay men must want to have sex with him. A very narcisistic view, for sure. :lol:

Quote:
i had previousely also talked about gays and religion. Im gonna Blunt about it you cant be catholic or cristian and be gay at the same time. How do you figure it be consideeeeered a blasphemy by your beliefe but you practice this constantly?


Good question. You can get into Clintonesque debates about what blasphemy really means ;)
...
or you can take the matter directly to God and have an open, direct relationship with Him, without going through man-made institutions.
...
or you can find another religion, another way of connecting with the divine. Christianity is just one religion, one system of beliefs, among many.

I turned to Zen Buddhism. I liked their no-nonsense approach of sexuality, the self, and life in general. Nowadays I feel there are as many religions as there are human beings on this planet: we all have our own way finding our place in the bigger scheme of things.
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cmontana wrote:
Some heterosexual men find the image of two lesbians together exciting. Being the sexual conqueror that he is, man sees two lesbians as potential conquests. A "let-me-just-slip-in-between-the-two-of-you" scenario; instead of one woman, he gets two. Of course the fact that they are lesbians, therefore not sexually attracted to him, is of no importance to a heterosexual man. ;)


Yes, I understand that, but it's still ironic none-the-less :)
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cmontana wrote:
Quote:
this is unpropor not only for your self but also for others.

cmontana wrote: People have a right to decide what is good for them. That's a basic human right.

Human right says that, your action should not cost harm for others.
and what is the harm here.
you violate the natural law.

Quote:
we were born with some certain rules to follow. "GOD"
and god did not allow this.

cmontana wrote: That is a belief, not a fact.

and this belief is been based on what....



Quote:
there is certain things in our life that we have to respect.
men and women are exist for a reason. opposite sex.
life continuity.
if so why we were not born all as male or female.
and to have sex you should always have opposite sex. male and female.

cmontana wrote:Is that what it's all about: making babies? Many heterosexual couples have no intentions of having children. Many can't have children, yet still become couples. Most couples do not consider their relationship to be based on procreation alone. Some of us don't think exclusively with what we have under the belly button...

yes i thing making babies is based on the continuity of life, if it stops what would happen.

Quote:
what about your child if your going to have? dont u think you will give different impression of what is life and why do we have different gender.

cmontana wrote: I will teach my child, if I decide to have one, to come to his own conclusions. That's part of what freedom means.

and what would u teach your children, are u going to make your own religion book.

Quote:
and the most important aspect for me is, how do really Gay people do sex, i find it very unpropor, you use the unpropor part of the body which is actually was made for different purpose.

cmontana wrote:A vagina is made for reproduction, yet many men use it for sexual pleasure, without intent to reproduce. Many women use their partner's penis for sexual pleasure also, without intent to reproduce. How about a mouth, or a hand, or any other part of the body that is used for sexual pleasure, and without intent to reproduce? Could it be there is more to sex than mere reproduction? Could it be that people also use sex to express feelings of love and intimacy? I see a person before I see a body; what do you see?

your penis are not created for fu** as** ,if its so vagina wouldn't be useful.
and your a** was not created for pleasure purpose.

Quote:
when i saw your message i knew you were gay, i dont know why, may be because of your avatar

cmontana wrote:Mmmmmh, maybe the fact that I said in my message that I was gay helped you a little :lol:

I dont really care what u r. we are only discussing a matter here :lol:
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read this

Why gay people should not be allowed to get married

12 reasons why gay people should not be allowed to get married

1. Homosexuality is not natural, much like eyeglasses, polyester, and birth control.
2. Heterosexual marriages are valid because they produce children. Infertile couples and old people can't legally get married because the world needs more children.
3. Obviously, gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.
4. Straight marriage will be less meaningful if gay marriage is allowed, since Britney Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage was meaningful.
5. Heterosexual marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all; women are property, blacks can't marry whites, and divorce is illegal.
6. Gay marriage should be decided by people, not the courts, because the majority-elected legislatures, not courts, have historically protected the rights of the minorities.
7. Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.
8. Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people will make you tall.
9. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage contract.
10. Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why single parents are forbidden to raise children.
11. Gay marriage will change the foundation of society. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and we could never adapt to new social norms because we haven't adapted to things like cars or longer lifespans.
12. Civil unions, providing most of the same benefits as marriage with a different name are better, because a "separate but equal" institution is always constitutional. Separate schools for African-Americans worked just as well as seperate marriages for gays and lesbians
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BlueHat, your post isn't even close to being factual nor appropriate to the topic. :roll:
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***8BlueHat, your post isn't even close to being factual nor appropriate to the topic.****


as u can see the topic has been moved to different query, so i had to go with it. :wink:
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you see, it's up to the parents wether to make there son guy or not, and that would be according to the atmosphere of wich is the son living in. but lets not go away from the qwestion, if my son would become a gey, then i'll just have to live with it and love him as my son because i know its my fault.
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Prince@bood wrote:
then i'll just have to live with it and love him as my son because i know its my fault.


Welcome to ozzu forum Prince@bood.

nice shot prince. sure u would have to live with it, but how would live with it.:wink:
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Hmm, that's true, how can someone live with it...
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BlueHat wrote:
read this

Why gay people should not be allowed to get married

12 reasons why gay people should not be allowed to get married

1. Homosexuality is not natural, much like eyeglasses, polyester, and birth control.
2. Heterosexual marriages are valid because they produce children. Infertile couples and old people can't legally get married because the world needs more children.
3. Obviously, gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children.
4. Straight marriage will be less meaningful if gay marriage is allowed, since Britney Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage was meaningful.
5. Heterosexual marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all; women are property, blacks can't marry whites, and divorce is illegal.
6. Gay marriage should be decided by people, not the courts, because the majority-elected legislatures, not courts, have historically protected the rights of the minorities.
7. Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America.
8. Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people will make you tall.
9. Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behavior. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage contract.
10. Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why single parents are forbidden to raise children.
11. Gay marriage will change the foundation of society. Heterosexual marriage has been around for a long time, and we could never adapt to new social norms because we haven't adapted to things like cars or longer lifespans.
12. Civil unions, providing most of the same benefits as marriage with a different name are better, because a "separate but equal" institution is always constitutional. Separate schools for African-Americans worked just as well as seperate marriages for gays and lesbians


Please tell me this post is a joke. Even if it is, it's not at all funny. Rather, incredibly immature. :roll:
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Prince@bood wrote:
you see, it's up to the parents wether to make there son guy or not, and that would be according to the atmosphere of wich is the son living in. but lets not go away from the qwestion, if my son would become a gey, then i'll just have to live with it and love him as my son because i know its my fault.


You see pretty confident that how parents raise their kids decide if they are gay or not. But considering cause has not ever been proven it's all speculation. You can blame yourself all you want, but honestly that makes no sense to me.
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I don't have a son so I can't really say how I would react. I'd probably be caught 'off guard'. I would only hope that I'd be reasonable enough not to freak out. I don't believe I would. I'd probably be uncomfortable around people I know didn't appove of it but that's my problem and not my 'son's.

Personally, I don't have a problem with homosexualality. I have 2 friends that are gay. One female, one male. I don't think it's really stupid as far as reproduction goes. Sure, if we were mindless beasts and the majority of the population were gay, then we might have a problem. It's not contagious, you know. Gay couples have children via artificial insemination/surrogate mothers. Adoption is another way. Of course, this doesn't really have anything to do with reproduction, but it is great that more couples are available to adopt children.

Besides, I think the population growth could stand to be curtailed somewhat.

Jim Roberts
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lostinbeta wrote:
BlueHat wrote:
read this


Please tell me this post is a joke. Even if it is, it's not at all funny. Rather, incredibly immature. :roll:



I was just making small research on the web and this what i found :lol: :lol:

but it still doesn't have to be immature. :wink:
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I am curious as to people's view on the religious argument on homosexuality. I have heard some people say that the bible 'clearly states' that homosexuality is wrong, and then also that there is nothing clear, only interpretation, or misinterpretation either way? Both views coming from scholars of the bible!
I personally am an aetheist, despite having been brought up as a christian, and my opinion is:
if god, heaven and hell exist, there is something significantly wrong with everything if a person spends their whole life helping others and making the lives of others better, and yet will go to hell, eternally damned, because they took part in a same-sex relationship, completely mutual etc. Can you honestly say that that person was a BAD, or even EVIL, person? That they deserve to go to hell? Does this not seem a little shallow or petty to anyone?
As for the nature argument (that it goes against nature etc). So does driving cars and creating complete imbalance with our surrounding environment and a million and one other things that humans do. I thought we had evolved beyond the instinctive level where procreation is the only meaning of life?
Basically, I'm saying that how can you criticize a gay person for being gay, when they have harmed no-one, and done nothing that could be argued, by rational and logical argument, to be wrong? How different is gay person to a straight person, in real ways that really make a difference to anyone else? At one time black people were seen as being very different - hopefully most people here would laugh at how ridiculous that is?
There is far to much intolerance in the world, and as far as I can see, intolerance and hatred are some of the most evil things in this world.

BTW my answer is support him, in case you couldn't tell!!
Sorry if i repeated what people have already said - I skimmed this post.
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I found this topic while searching on google for gay fonts, of all things (don't ask), and felt compelled to register and reply. I am gay, and when I came out, both of my parents (and my sisters too, for that matter), were completely accepting. My partner and I had a union ceremony a year ago, and all of my immediate family was there. My mom and dad had gone through a biter divorce and hadn't seen each other for years, but they got along for the duration of the ceremony and even walked me down the isle together (one on each side). My boss and another coworker were also present. I don't think it get's much better than that, but I would expect any parent, if they truly love their children, to at least accept them as they are and do everything they can to make them feel loved and welcome in this world, especially if they're still a teenager - the suicide rate among gay teens is twice that of straight teens (I know of one case where a mother told the son he might as well be dead, leading him to try to take her up on the offer). That is all that really matters. If you take away that safety net from someone, especially from someone still young with an evolving personality, you may not ever be able to forgive yourself for the consequences.

On the issue of religion, it wasn't so long ago that people were being burned at the stake for sugesting that the sun was the center of the solar system instead of the earth. Religion has been wrong _FAR_ more times than it has been right. We have come up with far better means of guiding morality and ethics in our society than fear of damnation - it's high time we learned to base our actions in logic and respect for the rights of others. If we as a society are incapable of successfully doing that then I suggest the human race should be written off as a failure right now.

As for gay mariage, following from the above, this issue is a clear no-brainer. Government has no business getting involved in the religious aspects of marriage. Marriage as recognized by the state should be simply a civil contract between two individuals conferring upon them all the rights and responsibilities relevant to their interaction with the government and secular society at large. That should be completely seperate from marriage as defined by the church and should require a completely seperate ceremony (as it does in Europe). If a couple chooses to have a religious ceremony in addition to the civil contract, that is their choice, but the government must not interfere with that in any way (thus, those churches who wish to deny gays the right to marry in their church are free to do so). That is the only logical application of the concept of the seperation of church and state to this issue. Anyting less than that is trampling on someone's rights, be it the church's or the individual's.

Needless to say, I am extremely pleased to see the situation in Masachusetts developing as it is, not because I wish to run up there and take part, but because it will ultimately completely nullify the argument against gay marriage, not through rhetoric which is all we've ha until now, but through rock solid example. Nothing can be done to stop those mariages until 2006 at the earliest, so the good straight people of Massachusetts will have plenty of time to see how utterly irelevant all this is to them. The "institution" of mariage (such as it is in a country where most marriages end in divorce within ten or fifteen years) will not in any way be damaged by this, no more so than it was by the striking down of miscegenation laws fifty years ago. The opposition will fade into the background now as then, and it will very quickly become a non-issue.

Anyway, that's enough of a disertation for one day, I think. If you would like to read more of my thoughts on this subject, please check out my blog, Speaking Freely:

http://www.webolutionary.com/freedom



BTW, here's a site I put up with pictures and the order of service from my union ceremony:

http://www.out-rageous.com/union

(yes, I actually am a webmaster, among other things)
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Congratulations on you and your partners union ceremony Sean.

I hope to have one in the future when I find "the one" as well.

And I too am pleased about the MA situation. I am hoping it will show people that it won't really effect anything as serverly as they are thinking. It seems a lot of people think it will catastrophically change the world in a negative way. Which is rubbish.
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funny thing. I just thought about this question a few days ago.
coincidence.

If my son is gay, there is nothing i can do. Just hope he will be happy and freakin successful like versace or something like that.

but before he turns gay, I will try to steer my son away frmo gay influences like (reputed gay schools, sissy friends, etc)

:wink:
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Wow, I can't even count the amount of stereotypes in that post on both of my hands.
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LOL

You can't steer someone away from being gay. That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. Nor do all gay men become fashion designers. ;) I think you might be surprised to know that I know gay lawyers, real estate brokers, physicists, undertakers, a tugboat captain, a customer service rep at the company in which I work, and more. I also know quite a few gay men who are anything but sissies (you'd never guess in a million years that they were gay). ;)
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My thoughts exactly Sean.
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btw, i've recently read that in a zoo, two male penguins were having a relationship(not just friends :P) and did whatever a male penguin would do with a female one. They also took a rock and act as if it was an egg! The people in charge there in the zoo, gave them eventually an egg to bring up.
That raised a lot of controversies 'cause those who supported the idea that being gay is against the nature and blah blah lost points(they still had another reason, though!).

Anyway, our ancestors(at least ancient Greek people), with the great culture etc etc kept their women in home and had relationships with men(not just one, ever heard of orgies? :))... Actually, they did it for different reason(underestimated women) but they still did it :P
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Quote:
Anyway, our ancestors(at least ancient Greek people), with the great culture etc etc kept their women in home and had relationships with men(not just one, ever heard of orgies?

Firstly the orgies wern't just men - they were mixed groups. Secondly, you have <b>no idea</b> about the "great civilisation" of the greeks and the romans, do you? Their civilisation was based upon war, slavery, rape, disgraceful economics, and a complete lack of respect for morality and human rights. Their idea of entertainmnt was the rape of slave women, by animals, on stage. The were far from civilised. Totally off-topic but everyone seems to think that just because ancient people had big buildings and philosiphy this makes them altruistic. They weren't.



Congrats to you sean, I had a look at you photos. I couldn't help thinking how many narrow-minded people would be totally shocked that it was just like a "normal" wedding. I agree with everything that has been said here, the problem is that humans are naturally xenophobic. Once everyone (who hasn't already :roll: ) gets over the fact that gay people are the same as everyone else, I'm sure they will find a new sub-group of humanity to suppress. The only time this will stop is if we find some aliens to start throwing our hate upon, until eventually we realise that they were the same all along. Maybe humanity, for the most part, <b>is</b> a failure...
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Post 3+ Months Ago

will try to steer . What i meant was to get him out of places with gays. ie. my high school has become a gay place in recent years. :lol:

so, things like that.. means within contrl of coz.
I must also agree that at times, there's ntohing you can do about yr son turning gay..

Gays have good fashion sense. That's why you can find a lot of gays in designing and hairdressing. :D
Dont you think so ?


And that's why there is a gay show targetting straight guys these days..
wow. their tastes aer so good! I quite like the show.
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you can also find straight guys in design and hairdressing.

And the only reason a particular place might apparently have a higher percentage of gay people is because the community is more open about it.

IE: there is one school where if you are openly gay you get bullied etc, another school where everyone is cool about it.

In the second school, will you have more gay people? No. what you will have is more <b>openly gay</b> people though. Just because someone isn't open about it doesn't mean that they are not gay. By sending your son to a school where homosexuality is actively oppressed, you do not reduce his chances of being gay. What you do is reduce his chances of being gay AND happy.

If someone is gay they will be. The best you can do is to avoid all bigotry when you bring up your child, do not put stereotypes and discrimination in their minds, and then they will grow up to be happy with themselves. If the happiness of your children is not more important to you than your own pride then there is something wrong.
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madmonk: Your son won't "turn" gay by being around gay people. Either your son is gay or he isn't... pretty simple if you ask me.

And no, not all gay people have good fashion sense. I wouldn't know fashion if it slapped me in the face. And I certainly have the most unoriginal hairstyle (spiked).

You need to seperate your facts and your stereotypes of gay people. They are regular people, with their own individual abilities and skills, their own personalities, etc. It just so happens that probably the most gay people you have seen/met/heard of were in fashion or hair design. That doesn't mean they all are.

[edit]
Oh, and removing your son from an environment where gay people exist is teaching him to avoid/hate them IMO. If you shelter yourself from all kinds of people, you will never understand that no matter what a person is still just a person.... race, religion, gender, sexual preference.... none of that should matter to anyone else.
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lostinbeta wrote:

And no, not all gay people have good fashion sense.



That is so true, but let's please add straight folks in there too. In fact, let's add a bunch of fashion designers. Sometimes I look at what is called "fashion" and I just want to fall over laughing.

I'll take my jeans, T-shirts, and tennis shoes any day of the week over something that would cost me half a grand and make me look like a circus clown.
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Well each one of us have different believes and thoughts but some thought are universaliazed which are based on religion.

Most religion people don't believe on this behavior.

I see that this action is only for human satisfaction nothing else.

But I am sure that with lesbian and gays the society wouldn't benefit from it.

I am a person who believes in God and God has created human in two different type men and women otherwise its human creation.
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BlueHat wrote:
Well each one of us have different believes and thoughts but some thought are universaliazed which are based on religion.

Some people's beliefs are based on sheer ignorance. To lump any group of people together and say "they're all the same" is ignorant. Stereotyping has nothing to do with religion, and I'm not for one second critisising anyone's beliefs.

Quote:
I see that this action is only for human satisfaction nothing else.

So is heterosexual sex using contraception. Is that then just as wrong as gay sex, because if you are not trying to create a baby then it is wrong? There are a million and one things that humans do just for our satisfaction, are all of those wrong too?

Quote:
But I am sure that with lesbian and gays the society wouldn't benefit from it.

The homosexual comunity causes no detriment to society either. Society would probably benefit by stopping stupid people, people with heredetary diseases, people with any other genetic "defect" from breeding. That way we can have a more intellegent, healthier society. Just because the whole would benefit does not make something right, and the reverse does not make something wrong.

Maybe I missed something, but I thought the most basic message that jesus brought to the world was temperence, and not judging others?

and as sean said, religion <i>has</i> got things wrong more often than right.... and more often than not right and wrong are not set in stone.



BTW sean, what is a "gay font", because I'm really curious about that one.
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So can u explain why does religion not allow gay and lesbians marriage. U want to tell me that religion has panned this just without any reasons.
and what a Coincidence that most of the religion share the same rule.

but bc human never like to be controlled by others, Thats way we have rape, robberies, killing, war and ....etc

for every cause there is a reason.

one god created human he created first a man and women not man and a man??

Quote:
So is heterosexual sex using contraception. Is that then just as wrong as gay sex, because if you are not trying to create a baby then it is wrong? There are a million and one things that humans do just for our satisfaction, are all of those wrong too?


that does not make Gay behavior accepted. Sure there are many satisfaction that human do which are wrong, but who has the power to stop them.

Quote:
and as sean said, religion has got things wrong more often than right.... and more often than not right and wrong are not set in stone.


That will depend on how u see ur religion.. There are many things that don't have an answer.
why men cant get pregnant.. but scientist are trying to making it happen...hehe.

On the other hand when gay adopt a child, how would the two "fathers" explain to the child what is the differences between the mother and the father, so that means we will have to come up with a third part of education which only concern gays and lesbians.

Child should be grown up with normal parents(father and mother).
For me I don't care what gays do, I see that the problem is our children future.

Also religion has not allowed rapping, so why we don't allow it. U might say here that rape cause harm, and i can say that gays behavior harm my children view of what is life and gender.

I would say here that gays and lesbian destroy the religion rules and human respects to the gender.
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rtm223 wrote:
BTW sean, what is a "gay font", because I'm really curious about that one.
Do a search on google for a font called groupsex (all one word), and then imagine a gay version of that. Or a font of muscled men in various positions to form the letters. I need to do a poster for a weekly drag show being named "Hump Daze".
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BlueHat wrote:
I hope this wont be very weird,

what would u do if ur son is GAY??


*grins -- don't forget Bluehat, you started the topic. So the replies you get shouldn't come as too much of a shock. I already voiced my opinion once rather clearly if I recall. However, your statement about "most religion people don't believe on this behavior" doesn't seem valid to me. I'm aware of a few Catholic priests that could probably nullify that as invalid pretty readily. Besides, even if one wasn't of the pursuasion to be gay, I'd be willing to place a bet that they probably gave it a thought or two once or twice in their lifetime.

To me the missing statement to that logic is "Most religions don't believe in this behavior. Religious people hold fast to their religious beliefs, therefore, most religious people don't believe on this behavior".

However much that version of the statement appears to be slightly more valid logic, it is still invalid given that neither of the two premises are proven true.

Besides, belief doesn't come into play here. In theory you should believe in it, because it exists. You can choose not to believe in it, but then you are denying reality. Now if we use the statement "most religious people don't agree with this behavior", you may be able to find a way to prove the validity of that, albeit unlikely. It is still a statement of opinion vs. a statement of logic unless you can prove the premise.
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BlueHat wrote:
So can u explain why does religion not allow gay and lesbians marriage. U want to tell me that religion has panned this just without any reasons.
and what a Coincidence that most of the religion share the same rule.

Not really, the "rules" were all instigated in a completely different time and culture to our own. A culture where women were second rate citizens and the world and way of life was completely alien to you and me. I'm sure if I asked my mum she would be able to supply me with plenty of examples of "rules" from the bible that have no relevance to the modern world.

If you are wondering about "rules" being in quotes, I'd like to reiterate my previous point that some scholars of the bible will tell you homosexuality is clearly wrong, and other scholors will tell you that there are vague references that could be interpreted in numerous different ways. Please can someone provide me with a reference that sets this in stone - book chapter and verse(s) and I'll look it up. I will also eat my own socks if you can show me something that is not open to interpretation. That should be enough insentive to get people looking.

BlueHat wrote:
but bc human never like to be controlled by others, Thats way we have rape, robberies, killing, war and ....etc
for every cause there is a reason.

I would like to point out the number of killings and wars that were (and still are) based upon religion, check out northern ireland for instance - christians killing other christians because they are "the wrong kind of christian"


BlueHat wrote:
Quote:
and as sean said, religion has got things wrong more often than right.... and more often than not right and wrong are not set in stone.


That will depend on how u see ur religion.. There are many things that don't have an answer.

Christians fed to the lions
The spanish inquisition
The crusades
the holocaust
Northern Ireland
The current "islamic" terrorist movement

All of these had some kind of religious motivation. These things were and are, wrong. You cannot deny that. This is history and fact we are talking about here, it's not open to interpretation as far as I am concerned. Religion has been the cause of many attrocities, and I don't care how you view your religion, none of that was acceptable


BlueHat wrote:
On the other hand when gay adopt a child, how would the two "fathers" explain to the child what is the differences between the mother and the father, so that means we will have to come up with a third part of education which only concern gays and lesbians.

Child should be grown up with normal parents(father and mother).
For me I don't care what gays do, I see that the problem is our children future.

Yeah I agree, to think that children might be brought up open minded is a terrnible thought...
I think a gay person has every bit of understanding as to the difference between a man and a woman, it's biology after all.

Quote:
Also religion has not allowed rapping, so why we don't allow it. U might say here that rape cause harm, and i can say that gays behavior harm my children view of what is life and gender.

I would say here that gays and lesbian destroy the religion rules and human respects to the gender.


And I would say that hiding the truth from children will cause much more harm, and will disrespect the child.

And, just as a reminder, I have my sock ready and am waiting for this reference :wink:
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Regarding children brought up by a gay couple - there is no higher incidence of homosexuality among those children than among children of straight parents. Do you need any more proof than that to understand that gayness has nothing to do with environment. ;);););)
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BlueHat: It sounds to me that you think children learn anything and everything by being spood fed it through parents and education. Children are smarter than you think, and are often aware of their surroundings even if you hide it from them. Many children of gay parents know and understand the situation their family is in. They still grow up to be who they are, not who someone makes them.
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I told myself I was going to aviod this thread, but. I. Can't. Help. It. I'm. Too. Political. AAArrrrrgggg.....

Intolerance, bigotry, prejustice... It's silly. It's pointless, and it makes the world a worse place. If you're that way because of your religion, then your religion is making the world a worse place, even if it's also done great good.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, and I respect those that post here a great deal (though I've only been here a very short time, and likely have a good amount of time to earn such respect from those here). But I find intolerance and close-mindeness abhorant.

If you happen to know a gay man or woman, and for what ever reason, don't like them... fine. But painting the entire homosexual population as evil, horrible terrible people is insane. It's NO DIFFERENT than the same logic that led to black slavery and apartied (sp?), to the ethnic clensing in Bosnia, the wholesale murder of Jews by the Nazis, the genocide in Rwanda.. the list goes on and on. The idea that anyone you don't even know and have never heard of, is somehow less because they are in some way different that you are is just insane.

Just for the record, I am not homosexual. I do have a number of homosexual friends, both men and women, whose friendships I cherish because they are good people, despite sexual practices I don't happen to find interesting (ok... you know what I mean =]). What's more, my marriage and relationship to my wife is in NO WAY lessened because two men or two women are in love with each other. If anything it's strengthed.

What's the point of marriage, really, if not love? Children? That's it? I can do that without getting married. Taxes? whatever... No, the basis of marriage is love, the other stuff is ancillary, and if you don't belive that... you might think very hard before getting married... spending 30 years with someone you don't love is going to be very difficult...

*sigh*

Sorry, I get really pissed when bigotry rears it's ugly head... I wish it didn't exist.

.c
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lostinbeta wrote:
BlueHat: It sounds to me that you think children learn anything and everything by being spood fed it through parents and education. Children are smarter than you think, and are often aware of their surroundings even if you hide it from them. Many children of gay parents know and understand the situation their family is in. They still grow up to be who they are, not who someone makes them.


Nicely said lostinbeta. In addition there are some children that I would much rather see live much happier lives with some gay parents that love them with their life, rather than parents that beat the living crap out of them.
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Or even just straight parents who are poor parents (but not abusive). There are so many unqualified parents out there who should be barred from having kids for any number of reasons that it is absurd to bar a perfectly good gay couple from having them simply on the basis of their orientation.
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eek, religion appears again, :/ lol
not that i dont agree with the idea of it, but imho religion can be quite a dangerous thing if used/maniplated/taught wrongly as evidenced above.

one thing i must admit that does annoy me very much is large organised religious groups trying to force the idea that theirs is the only true way upon people, i belive that there is no one 'right' way and that people can have their own religious ideas and beliefs whilst still being as, (or indeed more) morally wholesome than other 'mainstream' members.
I think basically i like the idea of freedom of thought without people trying to tell you your going to go to hell because you dont belive in their version lol :P


as for the gay question, personally i dont have a problem with it at all, i may find some thoughts of it a little ikky simply because i dont feel those kinds of desires/feelings myself, but i have no problem with others being that way if thats how they feel, i mean if it makes them happy then that has to be good, and i can't see an honest reason why a gay couple couldnt raise a child in an equally loving way as a straight couple.
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rtm223 wrote:
Firstly the orgies wern't just men - they were mixed groups. Secondly, you have <b>no idea</b> about the "great civilisation" of the greeks and the romans, do you? Their civilisation was based upon war, slavery, rape, disgraceful economics, and a complete lack of respect for morality and human rights. Their idea of entertainmnt was the rape of slave women, by animals, on stage. The were far from civilised. Totally off-topic but everyone seems to think that just because ancient people had big buildings and philosiphy this makes them altruistic. They weren't.

I forgot to use quotes on "great culture", there's supposed to be an irony, because everyone thinks whatever was done then is right. I am aware of what was happening there more than you might think. I know that they were mixed, did I say anyware that only men used to take part? I just used an example showing the "gay nature" of ancient greeks. I should stop here, we are going nowhere.
Sorry, the subject has become a conversation around homosexuality in general, that's why I mentioned.
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Tom the Great wrote:
Would support him anyway. It's his decision to make, not mine. I would still love him, still be a father and all that stuff, the relation ship wouldn't change.

Yes i know this was posted aawhile ago, but really, its not even the KIDS decision.
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As you know each one has is own opinion of seeing things.

But that doesn't make it right though.
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BlueHat wrote:
As you know each one has is own opinion of seeing things.

But that doesn't make it right though.


You realize that goes for your opinion as well right?
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I have never stereotyped gays or lesbians before. So guys out there, dont assume that I did :wink:

Just by looking at my messages, you can tell ?
If you have seen me with gays before, you can also tell that I dont prejudice or stereotype them. I quite like them!

Coz my school had lots of gays. friendly but girlish.
gay influence is strong in my school and they hang out in a group.
- steering away frmo gay influences..

gay designers and hairdressers R one of the best around!
and of coz there are also talented ones who are not gay.
I din say gays are the only ones who are talented.

And I agree with blueHat
Quote:
As you know each one has is own opinion of seeing things.

But that doesn't make it right though.


you guys are taking it to answering this post in 'right' or 'wrong' style.
This topic's controversial man.
:wink:
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lostinbeta wrote:
BlueHat wrote:
As you know each one has is own opinion of seeing things.

But that doesn't make it right though.


You realize that goes for your opinion as well right?



sure dude..
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madmonk wrote:
If my son is gay, there is nothing i can do. Just hope he will be happy and freakin successful like versace or something like that.

but before he turns gay, I will try to steer my son away frmo gay influences like (reputed gay schools, sissy friends, etc)

:wink:


If your son/daughter is gay...then doing those things will not prevent it trust me. I hate those stereotypes...i mean I am a lesbian. I have recently been involved in a serious relationship with my g/f for almost 6 months now. It is the happiest i have ever been. How can that be wrong. I am not gay because my parents raised me wrong. I am gay cuz that is how i am. Its not sumthing you become...it's not contageous. Everyone treats it like an epidemic and that is just stupid. Its these kind of comments and the little things that make gay kids commit suicide or never tell anyone because they are afraid. I will admit...my mom freaked out when she found out. That made it soo hard for me. Cept instead of keeping it in she told me to my face that i was wrong and she couldn't accept me but that she'd still love me. If that makes anysense. You guys need to open your eyes and tell me...really what is so wrong with homosexuality. And please stop with the stereotypes...most gay people dont fall under any of them. Just a bunch of stupid people went and did stupid things to create those stereo types.
  • Miss_Bee
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Post 3+ Months Ago

You go girl.....I salute you 100%. I'm bisexual and not afraid to admit that either....I actually believe gay people are the best friends you could EVER have in your life!
  • lostinbeta
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Miss_Bee wrote:
I actually believe gay people are the best friends you could EVER have in your life!


I think a lot of girls believe this...lol. My friend was ecstatic when I told her about me, now she wants to hang out with me even more than before.

Which is quite odd. But whatever, she's a fun gal!

Same goes with a few other of my female friends. And just a bunch of other girls I know in general.

Guys don't tend to think so though. Perhaps it is because they are too hung up on thinking they are going to get hit on. Which is quite a concieted thought :twisted: Or maybe they just aren't comfortable enough with their sexuality that they are afraid they might do something they will regret :twisted:
  • Miss_Bee
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Some guys can be real arseholes, I think we all know that, but then some girls can be the biggest bitches....its all modern day society which is too DAMN pig headed!!
  • Liquescence
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Hey, gay/bi people are fun. Half of my friends are bi. If my son/daughter were gay I wouldn't force them to change the way they are, but I would want them to think about consequences of it (ie. future children getting teased for having same-sex parents).
  • JnsBedORoses
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Post 3+ Months Ago

I just dont understand why people freak out when they find out sumone is gay...I mean most people can be really good friends and then when they find out their friend is gay they freak out like it might be contageous or the gay person might be out to kill them or *Oh NO!* <b>TOUCH THEM!!</b> I mean please. I lost my best friend of 5 years when i finaly came out. The way i see it i dont need her. I totaly understand that i prolly will be harassed for the rest of my life but that can't change who i am. Trying to get your son/daughter to realize this will only make them want to be sumone they aren't. If it is really what you are then you realize that the harassment and the jokes are really immature and stupid. Some of the jokes are sooo freaking rediculous. I don't know...these kinda topics get me fired up so sorry if it sounds like im just ranting lol.
  • SinisterDexter
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Post 3+ Months Ago

Why the hell do people even bother thinking about things like "Is my son gay?" My parental people are constantly studying me for even the slightest indication of homosexuality, and trying to be supportive and caring(I much preferred getting ignored), and they fail to accept the simple response I'M NOT GAY! Not saying I'd complain if I was, in fact I'd probably be better off if I was, at the moment I have a grand total of ZERO relationships in the past YEAR, so yep, desperate, ugly, crap and straight, that's why I don't have a girlfriend mom.

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